Thursday, September 23, 2010

In response

I just wanted to thank you all for your kind and well thought out comments on my last post :)  It's great to have these conversations, get people thinking, and I'm glad that I brought up the subject.

It actually doesn't concern me at all that the video is 12 years old.  In fact, it kind of makes me happy that it is that old.  It was made before the time of online mommies jumping on band wagons, so to say.  Not to say that there may not have been big issues with it then, but it isn't some internet propaganda.

Also, the information that they show is still accurate, even if it doesn't continue on into the 2000s.  I am very curious to know what the numbers look like now, and I hope to do a little more research into the whole thing.

I'm thankful that you are all concerned about my kids, and wanting me to make the right choice.  It's nice to know that you all care, and I don't take that lightly.  However, Rowan and Bria are both fully vaccinated, so I don't really think there is a huge risk factor, if that would pose a risk in the first place (I am not sure how big the risk is at this point).

I do have respect for Doctors, and I am so thankful for all of the help that they have given me over the years.  However, Doctors are not always very up to date with things, and I fear that vaccine research and facts may not be that high on their list of things to research.  They are busy people, and many of them specialize in certain areas of health and don't keep up with others.  For example, it is becoming fairly common knowledge among parents that solids are best held off until a baby is at least 6 months.  Years of research have proven that it is healthier for a babies digestive system, as it isn't truly ready for solids until around this time.  Not all Doctors are up to date with this information though, and I've heard time and time again that moms are being told that they need to feed their 4 month old solids.  Do these Doctors mean harm?  Not at all!  They just haven't had time to research the latest facts.

Like I said in my post yesterday, if I am presented with facts that prove otherwise, I will definitely consider them and weigh the options again.  But I can never take back a vaccine that has been given.  So for now, I choose to say no, and until I find proof otherwise, it will stay this way.

So many of the things some of you have said are things that I would have agreed with, up until yesterday.  But I hadn't really seen both sides of the issue up until then, and when I only wanted to hear one side of the issue, that is all I listened to.  I am glad I paid attention to "the other side" this time.

I welcome any other thoughts that you might have, and I would LOVE to see any other research that people have come across, for either side of the issue.  I want to make sure that what I read and hear is credible as well, so call me out on it if you find any facts proving this video is wrong.


JP said...

** This is the same as what I posted on Facebook, but I wasn't sure if you were on there much, so I thought maybe I should re-post it here. **

I haven't watched the entire video either, but some of what you said in your comment above is incorrect. The diseases we vaccinate against wax and wane with time, but they were certainly not "almost eliminated" when vaccines were introduced.... I don't know where they got that data to make that claim, but it's just not true. An example is right here in Winnipeg, where in 1953, just before polio vaccines were made available, there was a major outbreak, in which the King George Hospital (now Riverview Health Centre) was overflowing with polio victims and iron lungs had to be flown in from across North America to keep up with the need. It was the second largest outbreak ever in a major North American city.

And in areas where vaccination drops off, outbreaks of the diseases reoccur. This was seen strongly, for example, when vaccination rates fell in the former Soviet Union after it fell apart in the '90s, and diphtheria (which was the disease best studied) exploded and caused many deaths, mostly in children.

While the world may not be "overrun" if we were to stop vaccinating altogether, the diseases would certainly become widespread again, except, presumably, for smallpox, which in the '70s was successfully eradicated worldwide through, yup, vaccination. (That, in my opinion, is one of the most awe-inspiring achievements in human history, considering that smallpox killed about 2 million people per year in the early 20th century, to say nothing of the permanent disfigurement that survivors suffered.)

Also, antibodies are not just a marker of exposure -- they absolutely DO prevent disease; if you happen to have antibodies against a particular bug (bacteria or virus; your body has to produce a different antibody for each different bug, and there are thousands) floating around in your bloodstream, they will help to inactivate the bug, hopefully before it starts reproducing itself in your body. Even if you do not have enough antibodies to keep the bug from getting established, it still helps buy time for your immune system to ramp up production.

I'm not trying to criticize your choice not to immunize (it's absolutely, 100% your right to decide what goes into your kids' bodies), but it sounds like there's some highly inaccurate information in that video.

Samantha @ Mama Notes said...

I didn't watch the video yet, but I wanted to say I think it's great that you are able to change your mind about vax's. You probably know what we do... delay some and skip some, and no matter what we decide there is always pros and cons to each sides, i think.

Whatever you decide for your kids is best for your kids :) And don't ever feel afraid to voice your thoughts or opinions!! :)

Lindsey Dueck said...

The CDC has a lot of information. It is an American site though:

Here is a Canadian version, but it doesn't have as much detail but there are some good links you can follow through there:

Adventures In Babywearing said...

I vaccinated my first children because I didn't know there would be a reason not to. I never questioned it until my sons had horrible reactions, and my oldest son was having hundreds of seizures a day. Wake up call. Of course I know this doesn't happen to everyone, but it got me researching and what I found (to be TRUE) changed my life.

Our last two are completely unvaxed and are by far the healthiest of all my kids. With my first two, we were in and out of the pediatrician's office like a revolving door. My 2 year old has only seen the dr once and that was for a well check up at 1 year old. (she was born at home.)

A fabulous and wonderfully helpful video I just watched recently (and it was made in 2010) is Dr. Sherry Tenpenny's Vaccine Basics DVD. If you can watch it, I think it will make so much sense and clear up many misconceptions about vaccines.


Eva said...

This is obviously a hot topic {that's why I've never posted my opinion on it}. I will tell you one funny and one sad story on the topic though.

When our oldest two were in public school we would get a call from the public health nurse each time vaccinations came around. I simply told her I had no opinion on the subject but we were choosing not to vaccinate at this time. She went on to tell me that I was a irresponsible mother and that I was putting everyone else in the school in danger. I asked her how our children could be putting others in danger, after all, if they are vaccinated they shouldn't be affected by our kids right? She was speechless. And secondly, the only 'disease' our kids have had is chicken pox. That's the funny one.
The sad story. When our youngest son was six months old he was acting completely out of character one evening {he was crying uncontrollably and arching his back one minute and seemed unresponsive the next}. I took him in to the ER and the doctor there refused to treat him because he was not vaccinated. {I should say he refused to even touch him}. He went on to call me a horrible mother and that if my child was seriously ill and died it would be completely my fault. This time I wasn't as kind.. I responded with telling him that it wouldn't be my fault it would be his. {I sought help, he refused to treat him}.

It turned out to be a case of a stomach flu. {I went for help at the health food store after the doctor's office}.

Last time I checked we live in a free country and we, as parents, get to make decisions for our children. And, living in a free country with health care coverage we deserve treatment when we seek it.

Hope that's not too much info.. a have a few sore spots but often look back on them fondly.. we have survived so far!

Anonymous said...

I think danger in referring to an old video is that so much research and changes have happened since then. For one, the link between vaccs and autism has been studied and discredited. Also, this is a UK film .... they have different standards (as does US) from Canada.
I am not disagreeing with your choice to not vacc (especially as I am still on the fence with this), I just think we have to be very very careful about where our info comes from and how old. It makes our job as mothers very tough.... weighing, studying the research. Hmmm...

Dianna said...

I've studied up on vaccination 6 -7 years before i even got married and had kids.. After all the pros and cons.. we never immunized all 3 of our children and I stand firm in our decision in not immunizing, I have 3 beautiful healthy children. I still try to keep up to date with the topic. I don't push my opinion on anyone it's entirely up to u but will be helpful to anyone who wants info. We all want what is best for our children, and we all try to make the right choices [based on our knowledge] for our children.

Andrea said...

Just finished watching the video...and it confirms all of the research I've done on vaccines in the past as well. I actually bought a really good book about vaccines when Tate was a baby - it has all the info. of the video - plus WAY more. If you ever want to borrow it just let me know and I can send it back with my parents for you! (It is a book published in the USA, but lots of the data is far more reaching than just 'vaccines in the usa'.)

Watching this video makes me realize again that there is never a day that goes by where I regret NOT vaccinating my kids.

Ellen said...

I started watching the video but have not finished yet. Just from what you wrote, my biggest caution to you would be making decisions like that under an emotional influence. Obviously something struck you enough to make you cry (though I'm not sure what, but it's probably further along in the video) but I have always been cautious about emotional appeals (on any topic). I guess I believe that decisions need to be logical and informed, not based on someone taking advantage of a person's emotions!

The thing that made me laugh was all the disclaimers that were at the beginning of the video. Sorry but I thought that was kind of counter productive. I understand liability issues, but at the same time if they are revealing 'the truth' then there should be no negative impact of the information provided.

I understand that with the whole H1N1 outbreak and with you being pregnant at the time it adds a whole new level of questions to the vaccination topic. Although I was not pregnant at the time, I did really question whether or not it should be something me and my family should do. I chose not to vaccinate for that, my biggest issue was that I didn't like how it was a 'new' vaccine, all-of-a-sudden being pushed on the masses. There is a difference with the standard vaccines, they have a lot more information, background and study on those vaccines since they are not 'pushed through' due to an 'emergency' situation.

I think it's great to be cautious and make the decision you think is best for you and your family! I have enjoyed reading the different comments.

Stam House said...

I just read this post about doctor and baby solid food at four month, and I last weeks when to our family doctor Rachel is 4 months and he ask me

he: " what are you feeding her"

me: "My milk"

He: "you know that is ok to supplement with formula"

me "but she is doing well nursing I'll stick to nursing for now"

he: "Then you should started cereal soon so she wont be lacking of iron an losing too much weight"

then he proceed to weigh her

he: "Wow she is in the 85 percentile for weight"

Me " It's all that mama's milk she is getting hehe!"

We did end up having a good laugh after the awkward beginning of our appointment LOL!!!